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Talk:Severus Snape
NPOV "And then to give Harry a lesson in serious dueling"? Perhaps we need to watch for point of view on contraversial matters. Actually, I think I might create a subsection (maybe even a page) on the contraversy. But first I need to learn to spell that word. MadMuggle 02:00, 19 Dec 2005 (UTC) :"Controversy" :-) Hermione1980 17:16, 19 Dec 2005 (UTC) ::Thanks. :-D MadMuggle 02:26, 20 Dec 2005 (UTC) :::Perhaps there should be a template that warns of disputed or controversial topics. --kaiiiak 22:46, 7 Jan 2006 (UTC) :::There definitely needs to be a disputed/controversial tag of some sort because a lot of the information at the end of this article I have a hard time believing. ::::A ton of this info is speculation, that's why you have a hard time believing it. I tried to edit, but someone reverted. Not to mention the table looks like crap. I tried making that one a more organized one as well, but that was also reverted.--MajinSuperVegeta 21:57, 19 February 2007 (UTC) :::::You messed up the box pretty bad, that's why I reverted. I didn't bother looking at the text edits. John Reaves (talk) 22:20, 19 February 2007 (UTC) Organization Even though I'm not part of this wiki project, I definitely think this page is in serious need of organization. I will tell you that I am not going to change any information, I may re-word phrases, but I am simply going to organize the info into a more encyclopedic format. I understand if you feel that my edits are intrusive, but I really think that it has to be done by someone, and since no one else is stepping up, I am willing to. --MajinSuperVegeta 21:07, 27 April 2007 (UTC) :I organized some of it into a more encyclopedic format. Hopefully you guys like it. --MajinSuperVegeta 21:54, 27 April 2007 (UTC) Age and career correct? The article says he is two years older than the Marauders (1960 born and 1971-78 students,as a rule) rather than in the same year...are you sure? Also,is it really confirmed that he was Head of Slytherin as soon as he joined the faculty?...he would be remarkably young for such a senior position already,and if any other Slytherin were on the faculty when Slughorn left and Snape became Potions Master,I would expect that senior to be Head until unknown retirement before the novels started.--Louis E./le@put.com/12.144.5.2 00:17, 22 July 2007 (UTC) He is not two years younger then the Marauders, the book says that the were all in the same year. --Lupin & Kingsley 02:35, 3 January 2009 (UTC) Confusing Statement in Interest in Lily Potter what does this mean and is it necessary/accurate? "Although few clues conforted it before the tome five publication, it has been fanon for a long time that Snape loved Lily when they were classmates. Tome 5 shows that they had an ambigious relation, as James and Lily did." Relationship to Harry Potter It might be noteworthy to explain the complicated relationship between Harry and Snape. Although this is only revealed in Deathly Hallows, I do believe it is important to Snape's true character! --Earthsprite 07:46, 23 July 2007 (UTC) (a lurker) I have to disagree with you. In the books the only reason Snape hates Harry is because he thinks he is like James which is recognized in the article. --Dumblydoor 10:08, 7 March 2008 (UTC) That is correct --Lupin & Kingsley 03:16, 3 February 2009 (UTC) :It can't all be chalked up to Harry's similarity to James. JKR stated in an interview that Snape's bitterness towards Harry comes from the fact that Harry is "living proof of Lily's preference for another man." ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 22:28, 4 February 2009 (UTC) Quote related to Petunia in Interest for Lily Evans The quote is actually "awful boy" not "horrible boy." Yes, it's picky, but it is a quotation. :Note: The quote may differ depending on US vs. Canadian/UK publications. --Earthsprite 09:15, 30 July 2007 (UTC) The Actual Timing of Snape's Overhearing the Prophecy It is a remarkable feature that this page covers the continuity and consistency of the plot. I got great pleasure from such brainstorming. Thank you! But somehow lack of carefulness exists in the second paragraph of Involvement with Death Eaters. I don't think there is a plot hole in the actual timing of Snape's overhearing the prophecy. Rowling has made herself clear with ink and paper. The actual timing of it, in my opinion, is at the point when Trelawney is RESTATING her prophecy. That is, she tells the prophecy to Dumbledore not just for once, but speaks the first half again before Snape is found by Aberforth and then Trelawney regains consciousness. Therefore, Snape mistakenly thinks that he has overheard the whole version of the prophecy, which is in fact incomplete, the restated first half. Please refer to p. 841 (USA) or p. 741 (UK), Book 5. You can see the prophecy in the Pensieve appears in an A-B-A form (A: the first half, B: the other half). It is unlikely that Dumbledore "replays" the memory, causing the A-B-A form. Obviously, he just conjures the memory, which exactly projects how Trelawney makes her prophecy then. --Nanpyn 10:23, 20 August 2007 (UTC) Another most likely possibility is that Snape trails Dumbledore and Trelawney and overhears the prophecy from the very beginning. But he fails to listen to the other half when Aberforth catches him and distracts his attention to the rest of the prophecy. Therefore, he can only report the first part he remembers to the Dark Lord. --Nanpyn 12:43, 20 August 2007 (UTC) :The second theory seems more likely. Trewlawny starts saying the prophecy, Aberforth discovers Snape, a struggle ensues while Trewlawny finishes the prophecy and then Aberforth shows Dumbledore who's listening at the keyhole - hence Trewlawny seeing him - and then throws Snape out --forgottenlord 19:55, 22 July 2009 (UTC) Blood Status ok so i changed something, i hope you dont mind. but i noticed that someone had put that snape was halfblood. he wasnt, he called himself half-blood prince cause he had half of his blood come from his mother, eileen prince. get it? :Wrong. He called himself half-blood because his father was a muggle and his mother was a witch. See Half-Blood Prince for more info. Thanks, —Animagi/Prongs 02:28, 9 September 2007 (UTC) Half Blood Prince I see no good reason to combine the two articles. They are important different concepts and the fact that Severus may be the Half Blood Prince is not sufficient reason to combine them. If there are no objections, I will remove the suggestion in a few days. Al Hart 00:18, 24 October 2007 (UTC) :The two articles are about the same character and therefore should be merged to the same article. Snape is the Half Blood Prince. -- DarkJedi613 (Talk) 04:45, 24 October 2007 (UTC) ::I might be open to being convinced of the reasoning to merge the two pages, but I am not as yet. The HBP page originally was a discussion about the spell book and the reasoning for identifying Snape as the HBP as much as anything. As far as I am aware, there remains considerable confusion about that book and how it came about. Has Rowling said anything definitive explaining the nature of Lily and Snape's partnership in developing the spells? It remains unclear whether Snape was any sort of genius at potions while at school. (Please show the evidence that he was) Sandpiper 00:50, 24 January 2008 (UTC) Oh, and the article once again contains that heresy: Snape admits to being the Prince. The book is inscribed as property of the prince. Snape doesn't say he wrote it. Sandpiper 01:00, 24 January 2008 (UTC) :Snape admits this is his nickname when he refers to himself as "I, the Half-Blood Prince" in HBP28. In addition, that chapter is called "Flight of the Prince," and the chapter in DH covering the story of Snape's life is "The Prince's Tale." ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 17:38, 14 May 2009 (UTC) Affiliations Shouldn't Snape's afflilations be Lily Evans, because he loved her and he did everything believing he would get her in the end, and Albus Dumbledore (not the order of the phoenix) because he put all of his faith and followed all of dumbledore's orders after lily died for the rest of his life —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Voltage624 (talk • ) }| }|}}. FA nom Should the FA nomination template be on the aricle...? 19:54, 28 December 2007 (UTC) :Since it's up for FA, then the nomination template should be on the top. - [[User:Cavalier One|'Cavalier One']](''Wizarding Wireless Network'') 23:28, 28 December 2007 (UTC) Snapes final orders In DH we see a number of flashbacks of Snape's memories which he gives to Harry. The last of these basically suggests that while Dumbledore has been jollying Snape along to fight death eaters and protect Harry, because Harry is all that is left of Lily, at the last Dumbledore just says 'well, ok, Harry's got to die now, get on with arranging it'. Do we really believe that Snape went to his own death believing this was Dumbledores plan, and that Snape willingly went along with arranging Harry's death? Sandpiper 00:56, 24 January 2008 (UTC) Elder Wand plot I'm curious, but as a part of Harry Potter Wiki:Harry Potter Wiki Projects/Project Greasy Git, should there be a section about Dumbledore's plotting his death with Snape and the intended result? --Cubs Fan2007 07:51, 5 June 2008 (UTC) :I think it should definately be added. -- [[User:Freakatone|'Freakatone']] [[User talk:Freakatone|'Talk']] 11:37, 5 June 2008 (UTC) ::I think it would be a good idea to add a section of this kind to the article. The plan which Dumbledore secretly convinced Snape to take part in played a large role in the last two books (and in Snape's eventual fate). Also, good work starting out the "Relationships" section, Cubs Fan. :) -Starstuff 18:40, 5 June 2008 (UTC) :::Thanks. It's still a work in progress, but I like it so far. And I'm working on getting some screenshots. --Cubs Fan2007 18:50, 5 June 2008 (UTC) As a Death Eater... In that section, it reads: "Trelawney prophesied that at the end of July, a child would be born who would cause the destruction of Lord Voldemort (which impressed Dumbledore sufficiently to hire her). At that time it was not clear who was meant by the prophecy, or even precisely which month was meant." How was the month not clear? Stevehim 06:49, 27 July 2008 (UTC) :I have no idea what the person who wrote that meant. Ill remove it. 06:57, 27 July 2008 (UTC) ::The Prophecy simply states the one to defeat Voldemort will be "born as the seventh month dies." As there is no specific mention of July, only birth in the "seventh month," it is possible to interpret The Prophecy as referring to a child born two months premature (i.e., at seven months gestation). I imagine that's what whoever added the bit about the calendar month being unclear was thinking. ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 18:22, 28 January 2009 (UTC) Snape's height This article described Snape as "tall," but I don't recall any direct references to Snape's height in canon, only that he was shorter than Yaxley (DH1) and significantly shorter than Sirius (OOTP24). ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 03:19, 16 January 2009 (UTC) Did Snape and Lily ever kiss? Just wondering.... KH 18:27, 28 January 2009 (UTC) :JKR stated that Lily only loved Snape as friend, but we can't know for certain what did or did not go on between them, outside of what's shown in "The Prince's Tale." ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 19:18, 28 January 2009 (UTC) Oh....ok. Dammit! KH 19:39, 28 January 2009 (UTC) Magical Powers In what book and context is it made known that Snape, like Voldemort, has he ability to fly without the use of a broom?--IBelieveInTheHallows 22:16, 9 April 2009 (UTC)IBelieveInTheHallows :Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows. After fighting McGonagall, Flitwick and Sprout, Snape runs into a classroom. When Harry, Luna and the teachers enter it, they see a broken window and Snape flying in the distance, like a bat. -- [[User:Seth Cooper|'Seth Cooper']] [[User talk:Seth Cooper|'Owl Post']] 22:20, 9 April 2009 (UTC) :Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Chapter 30 - The Sacking of Severus Snape. ----ÈnŔîčö (Send me an Owl) 02:33, 10 April 2009 (UTC) :There's even a little comment by Harry along the lines of "Looks like Snape has learnt a few tricks from his master" --forgottenlord 20:13, 22 July 2009 (UTC) Snape's Dying Words What exactly did Snape mean by “look ... at ... me ... "? Under the Death section, it says something about him wanting to see Lily’s eyes one last time. I certainly don’t remember him saying anything like that, so I edited that part out. I think there is ambiguity as to exactly what he meant, but somehow it doesn’t seem in character for him to say that because of that. Snape has always been good at hiding signs of feeling, and even in death I would think he would be more reserved. --LeocadiaBegbick 03:25, 7 May 2009 (UTC) :In Deathly Hallows, Ch. 33, it is implied that Snape was fond of Lily's eyes, because Dumbledore seems to have thought he could convince Snape to work to protect Harry after Lily's death by directly comparing Harry's eyes to Lily's: "Her son lives. He has her eyes, precisely her eyes. You remember the shape and colour of Lily Evans's eyes, I am sure?" JKR also stated in 1999 that Harry having his mother's eyes would be "very important in a future book." While I wouldn't call it "important," the eye contact between Harry and Snape in Snape's final moments is certainly moving, and it does reveal a lot about Snape. :I personally like to read a deeper meaning into Snape's dying request. In the scene, Snape gave Harry his memories — a complete, unvarnished account of his life — so I think that "look at me" was another way of asking "see who I am." It's been pointed out that Snape gave Harry more memories than were needed to comply with the request from Dumbledore to tell Harry he was a Horcrux. Snape must have therefore chosen some of the memories for personal reasons. I think that he wanted Harry to understand his side of the story, but I don't think he would have willingly chosen to reveal it under any circumstance but imminent death. Death obviated him of having to deal with Harry's feelings, particularly his reaction to the memories. :Of course, since we don't see Snape's death from his own perspective, we can only speculate on what he meant with "look at me." ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 20:51, 11 May 2009 (UTC) Thats a pretty amazing ananylis. I never even thought of that, though I suspected he wanted to see Lily's eyes one last time. Your right, in order to clear his name all he had to do was show Harry the memory of Dumbledore arranging his own death. I think your spot on, he didnt want Lily's son to hate him. Jayce Carver Talk 07:18, 12 May 2009 (UTC) Amen. LeocadiaBegbick 19:21, 12 May 2009 (UTC) :I don't think clearing his name to the wizarding world was the foremost concern of Snape's. After all, he thought Harry had to die, and thus probably assumed that the secret of his true allegiance wouldn't survive to become public knowledge. I'm not sure Snape intended to change Harry's low opinion of him with the memories, or simply to set the record straight in terms of things which Harry had been lead to believe about him, but the memory of him crying over Lily's picture seems to have been included strictly to give Harry a glimpse into the workings of his mind and heart. ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 17:19, 14 May 2009 (UTC) I don't think Snape really cared about Harry's approval. I think that he just wanted Harry to know the whole story. And I completely agree---that image of him crying all over Lily's letter was not needed in clearing his name. Neither was the memory of him and Lily as young children. As you said, I think he was showing a rare flash of his vulnerability. LeocadiaBegbick 01:13, 29 May 2009 (UTC) Foreign Language Names I'd like to see Snape's names in other languages, because it is different. However, I don't know what they are. Help? gadzin1203@gmail.com 23:52, 11 May 2009 (UTC) :There is a list of the different names given to Snape by translators at List of characters in translations of Harry Potter. ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 17:26, 14 May 2009 (UTC) "Snape told Dumbledore that he couldn't bear for anyone to know about his feelings for Lily, especially Harry." I saw this somewhere in the article but I didn't edit it out, because I'm not sure... where exactly in the book does it say that? Well that is comfirmed in the chapter, The Prince's Tale in Deathly Hallows with this quote: -- [[User:Hellabore|'Hellabore']] (''Deathly Hallows'') Rowling passing the Lily spoiler to Rickman "J.K. Rowling passed the spoiler that Snape had loved Lily his entire life on to Rickman in order for Rickman to capture the character. Rickman was the only person to know of this until the release of the Deathly Hallows." Is there a reliable source anywhere that cites this? LeocadiaBegbick 18:10, 21 June 2009 (UTC) *Citation added. Nick O'Demus 18:22, 21 June 2009 (UTC) Where is the citation? I can't seem to find where it is in the article. LeocadiaBegbick 20:53, 21 June 2009 (UTC) *Number 11 under Notes and References. Nick O'Demus 02:19, 22 June 2009 (UTC) ::It's now at number 7. The Pottercast interview was listed twice under "Notes and References," so I combined the newer instance with the earlier one. ★ Starstuff (Owl me!) 15:48, 24 June 2009 (UTC) House points Several times in the books, Snape took points from students (especially Gryffindors), but did Snape ever GIVE points to anybody? I can't recall a single instance when he ever awarded points, even to Slytherins. Nick O'Demus 21:11, 24 June 2009 (UTC) Snape vs Lily Credit for Potions skill There was a point in Half-blood Prince where Slughorn references Snape's skill as a potions student. During the Christmas party, Slughorn was telling Snape how good Harry's potions were praising a particular potion as being almost as good as Snape's or something along that line (I don't have the book in front of me right now). As such, Snape may have been performing to his level of expertise in Slughorn's classes but Slughorn merely referred to Lily over Snape simply because of the family connection. Either way, that paragraph is incomplete without noting Slughorn's comment -- 18:11, 15 July 2009 (UTC) :For the record, that was me above - just so we're clear on how many people are supporting this action :I removed the paragraph outright as I felt that it was not supported by what is stated in the book. Below, I quote various lines from Half-Blood Prince. Page numbers are from Canadian version, hardcover. Basically, there is no evidence to support the claim that Slughorn "praised Lily as his best student and failed to mention Severus". As I show below, he never actually says she's his best (just really good) and he clearly praises Snape's own ability. Not mentioning Severus is likely because he was focused on the family link and not concerned with who his best or worst students were ::There was no clear explanation of why Slughorn later praised Lily as his best student, and failed to mention Severus :I could not find a place where Slughorn said Lily was his best student - perhaps I missed something, but I certainly didn't see it. What I did find, though: ::You shouldn't have favorites as a teacher but she was '''one' of mine. ... Lily Evans. One of the brightest I ever taught'' -Slughorn, Ch 4 (Horace Slughorn, pg 70, bottom) ::Good Lord, it's clear you've inherited your mother's talent. She was a dab hand at Potions, Lily was! -- Slughorn, Ch 9 (The Half-Blood Prince, pg 181, bottom) ::But I don't think I've ever known such a natural at Potions! ... Instinctive, you know - like his mother! I've only ever taught a few with this kind of ability, I can tell you that, Sybill - why even Severus - ... You should have seen what he gave me, first lesson, the Draught of Living Death - never had seen a student produce finer on a first attempt, I don't think even you, Severus -'' -- Slughorn to Trewlawny, Harry and Snape, Ch 15 (The Unbreakable Vow, pg 298-299) ::''Just like his mother, she had the same intuitive grasp of potion-making, it's undoubtedly from Lily he gets it -- Slughorn, Ch 18 (Birthday Surprises, pg 355, 3rd Paragraph) :--forgottenlord 03:16, 22 July 2009 (UTC) Deleting the vampire comment The vampire comment is silly and is not needed. He isn't a vampire, there is nothing in the books to suggest that he is a vampire, and Rowling herself said he is not a vampire. There's no reason to have this section included. Counterpoints? WorfoSAUR 20:53, 17 July 2009 (UTC) : I kept but cut down the paragraph and linked to Rowling shooting down the theory.MaesterTonberry 08:21, 18 July 2009 (UTC)